Destiny Farm - Arabians, NSH, & Pintos

Destiny Farm, Box 2647, Vanderhoof, BC V0J 3A0 - Phone:250-567-9492 Fax:250-567-9252 email: destinyfarm@hotmail.com

Dedicated to breeding beautiful, versatile, quality
Arabians, NSH & Pintos with
excellent dispositions.

Are you in someone else's frames?

Determining full grown size of a horse

At 6 months, a horses' cannon bones are fully developed. To determine how tall he WILL be,
measure the distance from the center of the knee joint along the contours of the front of the
bone to the coronary band. 15" = 15hands 15 1/2" = 15.2hands and so on.
Steve Vulcan

Early breeding

If you want to breed mares early in the year, leave your barn lights on until your bedtime so the horses will think the days are longer. This should be started about November.

I live in a "selenium deficient" area. Most people, including myself put out a salt block with selenium in it. However it has been disputed that this is not good enough. Some people give their foals selenium shots upon birth too. Does anyone know of a vitamin or supplement to give broodmares that has enough selenium in it to do any good during pregnancy?"

There is a product called Megasel. It consists of selenium and vitamin E. I have used it and it did wonders for a run down ex-race horse I bought.

From Kevin Pickeron:
There is a supplement called Northwest supplement, this supplement has plenty of selenium in it, but you only want to use it in a selenium deficient area, because to much selenium can be toxic to horses. If you have a pregnant mare, feed her the normal amount throughout her pregnancy, but at least through the last trimester of her pregnancy when the foal is developing and growing fast. Selenium shots work as well, but this supplement provides selenium as it is needed. NW supplement cost about $16.00 for a ten pound bag and the directions have you feed 4 ounces to a 1000 lb. horse.

From J.E. Bazylinski:
My solution working with pregnant mares in a selinium deficient area is to provide grain feedings originating in areas not having the selenium deficiency' In Ontario - it means buying oats produced in the western provinces. I do not believe in the artificial supplements & tend to shy away from unessential shots. I have never had a problem with muscle development in my foals.

"I have a question in regards to Paints. We just purchased a bred red/roan overo mare. She is bred to a black & white overo stud. The mare has a bald face with two blue eyes. My question is? What is the percentage of our chance of getting a lethal white foal? We just had a friends mare produce one and it kind of scared us. Does anyone know which mares are more likely to through one or is it just a big fluke?"

From LeeAnn Ehlke:
Your chances of having a lethal white foal depends on the coat patterns of the horses that were bred together. You have the highest chance of producing a lethal white foal if you breed a frame overo to a frame overo. It would be best if you had a knowledgeable paint breeder come by and look at your mare. They could also look at pictures of the stallion to determine what coat pattern the horses have. If your mare or stallion is a sabino coat pattern, then there is a very small chance that the pair will produce a lethal (sabino is a coat pattern where the markings are very small and almost roanie looking.
From Linda Good:
Anytime you breed two overos together you technically have a 25% chance for a Lethal White, but they feel a lot of these babies are absorped as fetus' so the average comes out at 8 to 10% births. They only recently can identify the mutant lethal white gene. I assume this means we will be able to have our overos tested to see if they carry it. They must both pass this gene for the baby to be lethal. There are three overo color patterns, frame overo, splashed white and calico white. The frame overo is most known for the lethals. A lot of we Paint breeders do breed two overos together because this gives us the best chance for color, we just have to know that we are taking a chance of a lethal. Yes, I have had one and it was out of a breeding stock mare. Try not to worry, I'm sure you will have a beautiful colored foal.

From Irene Stamatelakys:
You'll find an informative article titled "Lethal Whites--A Light At The End of the Tunnel" on the American Paint Horse Association's web site.
The address is: http://www.apha.com/phj/features/LethalWhites.html
Also, the University of Minnesota offers testing for the syndrome. The address is: http://134.84.120.9/olws/

From Ann Mahoney:
Regards to "Lethal white foal": I came across a webpage that has some helpful information on lethal white foals. It's located at http://www.equiworld.net/global/faqs/b.htm, this page is sourced from REC. EQUESTRIAN. Hope it helps.

Today's tip is from Tina Woodley:
Vicks Vapo Rub can be used on stallion's noses to give a shiny appearance during shows, but can also mask the smell of in-heat mares, keeping your stallion's focus on his class during the show.

"I'm wondering what experienced breeders do to provide free access grain to foals while keeping the mares away. We have used foal feeders in the past, but the mares practically destroy them by banging them around in order to reach through the bars to get at the grain. Any suggestions?"

From Eve Hadlock:
Depending upon if the foals are in pasture or inside. If the foals are out in the pasture with their moms during the day, you can build an area where only the foals have access by placing a 2x4 at the height that it makes it difficult for the mares to enter. This works wonders and the foals get what they need to eat. If you have a barn and have wood interior this type of a situation can also be contructed in a corner with the same technique. Foal feeders are a waste of money because the mares want that grain as bad as the babies and will tear them up and even go as far as to be creative with their tongues in getting between the bars of the grates.

From J.E. Bazylinski:
I have found the most effective manner of allowing foals freedom to eat without interference from the mares is to provide an area(stall) with a barrier allowing foals to wander in & out underneath while the mares are blocked from entering. Once the foals discover this feeding station - they readily leave the sides of the mares to partake of the goodies. As the foals grow taller - the barrier may need to be raised.

From Jennifer Sale:

You want a "creep feeder." It's a small paddock, accessible from the main one, with a gate-like opening. The secret is a top rail (BUILD THE GATE SOLID), which is just high enough for the foals to get in, and too low for the mares... If you've got any sassy mares who like to crawl under things, or even try, separate those mares to another feeding area. I had a mare that got halfway under the top rail and stood up. She stayed there for a while wondering if this was a good idea, then reared a bit and lifted an end of the pole! Nobody got hurt, and she didn't try again, but she busted my rail! You can put the feed buckets on the ground or hang them on the fence. Creep feeders work well in a corner of the field or paddock.

From Liz Rocklin:
We put the creep feeder into one specific stall and make sure that the foal knows where it is. Then we put up a nylon web barrier across the stall door, tall enough so the mares cannot get in, but low enough so the foal can fit through. This way, the babies can eat all they want and the mares are kept away by the web barrier.

From Betty Cruzen:
Creep Feeders (small ones) do not work as you stated, because the mares will tear them apart as I've learned. A friend of mine hired a welder and a feeder was constructed with a heavy pipe across the front of a shed-type housing. The baby could go under, but the mare couldn't cross it with her shoulders. This works fine if you want to go to the expense, and of course those babies grow fast. I find the easiest thing is the most practical and important: Let that baby drink from its mare and make sure the mare is well fed - grained twice a day with plenty of free-choice hay or grasses. After a couple of weeks the foal will be eating grain with its mare anyway. I've been raising babies for 15 years and every one has been show quality and sometimes too fat. Relax and watch those babies grow.

"I have two mares I would like to breed and wanted info on what to look for in breeding for color in the foals. The one mare is a sorral and the other is a sorral with a flaxen main and tail. I know you need to look for conformation, temperment and other traits but what do you look for in a stud to throw color?"

From Stephanie Steere:
In regards to a colored foal. We breed primarily quarter horse mares to our paint stallion. Both sides need to be considered. In a stallion (paint) blue eyes, tho unattractive to some people are a good indication of the genetics it takes to produce color. Lots of body white helps also. Look at the sires pedigree. Is he paint both sides? If he isn't check out his produce record. In mares we find Sonny Dee Bar and Skipper W are almost always a sure thing. Both of these bloodlines are known for their crop outs produced. We look for broodmares with colorful backgrounds, white socks and maybe a white dapple or lots of white on the face. We have also had fantastic luck with solid mares. I can't stress enough check out the stallions produce record with its breed association. Sometimes great things come in uncolored packages.

From Nina Sala:
Depends on what color you want <G>. Your mares are sorrels or chestnuts, so if you want chestnut, breed to another chestnut. If you want pinto coloring, breed to a homozygous pinto (pinto and Paint people test their horses for homozygous color gene). If you would like to have A ppaloosa coloring, find a "few spot" Appy stallion and you will be assured of Appaloosa coloring, for these are the homozygous Apps. For palomino color, breed your mares to a cremello stallion, and you will be guaranteed of receiving the dilute gene. There is a test for homozygous black, but I think it just guarantees you won't get bay markers, and you could still get chestnut from the cross. There are many top notch horses available for breeding within each of these color groups...so happy hunting <G>.

From Paintfilly:
breeding for color,
Here is University of California at Davis Equine Genetics web page http://www.vgl.ucdavis.edu/~lvmillion/ They have information on the Overo, the Tobiano, specific hair color and so on. Its a good site and should answer many of your questions.

From Kim Roggenkamp:
If you are interested in color 100% of the time when breeding to a paint stud then you need to look to the Homozygous Tobiano pattern. Make sure the horse has a certificate that says it is tested Homozygous. This horse has been tested(blood) to throw color 100% of the time regardless of breed and color of the mare. Also, if you are looking to breed to a black stallion then you need to breed to a Homozygous Black Producer and you will get a black mane and tail from this mating unless your colt is very white, then the mane and tail will have lots of white and you should be able to see a trace of black somewhere within. You should really see what is more popular in your area; Tobianos vs. Overo. Breeding Stock(non-colored paints) can be just as valuable as their colored counterparts.

Today's foaling tip is from Angie Bowald:
I use a 2.4 or 4 oz baby food jar and place iodine in the
jar with the lid on and have a tetanus shot ready in anticipation of the foal. When the foal arrives, I take the baby food jar out and uncap it and dip the navel in the iodine. You know you have soaked the navel this way, and you don't get covered with iodine. I have a spray bottle of iodine or neomycin solution ready for the feet and any other minor cuts that may been incurred on the mare or foal during the foaling process. If you are concerned about carrying the glass container out to the barn, wrap it once with duct tape or use a plastic container of about the same size.